Across the world is the shocking news that immediately following western 'intervention' in Libya, the rebels had abused and mass murdered 66 loyalists, in addition to Colonel Gaddafi and his Son Mutassim!
Libya has become far, far more unstable than it ever was under Colonel Gaddafi, just the same as Iraq, Afghanistan and everywhere else the US-led invasions have occurred. How many countries do we need to destroy before we see the already obvious pattern of destruction and inability of the military to change ay country by brute force?
http://rt.com/news/libya-gaddafi-execution-hrw-608/
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2012/10/17/libya-militia/1640181/
The First Dragon: That said, the NATO didn't have anything to do with these killings; they were mainly providing air cover for the rebels, and the rebels included all kinds of people, good and bad.
Seadeva: Of course, NATO did! NATO bombed several pro-Gaddafi convoys which very likely led to the capture of Gaddafi or, at the very least, actively supported the rebels to capture and kill Gaddafi and other loyalists en route to Misurata. There's a difference between providing air cover and targeting fleeing convoys indiscriminately. Providing air cover to the rebels alone is direct military intervention. Do we really know who these 'rebels' are? Why did they get their weapons? Did NATO really care?
The First Dragon: If NATO had committed these crimes, of course they would have been called to account. Civilized people don't do that kind of thing.
Seadeva: Is this the same 'civilized' people that are continually being reported by Middle East and western human rights organizations for numerous abuses? The same NATO that reclassifies some civilian sites as military targets during their operations? The same NATO that supports the US-led Drone strikes under falsified targeting figures around the world? The same NATO that supports killing potential targets first and adhering to International Law and convention, if it has to! Have we forgotten Sirte where at least 47 civilians were killed due to NATO strikes?
The First Dragon: After all, Qaddafi was a real bad guy, and many of the Libyans wanted something better. And maybe they will get it, eventually.
Seadeva: Whether he was 'good or bad' he was the recognized ruler of Libya by western powers UNTIL he became unpopular! Surely, it should be for the Libyans to choose their rulers? Whether they make a good or bad choice is up to them, these people are adults and can quite easily change their governments, if they really wanted to. Why else was the Arab Spring quickly quashed by foreign-backed insurgents, financial monopoly and secretive weapons deals! Because the self-same uprising WAS changing these countries. Oh, yes there's nothing like 'civilized' intervention to calm the storm!
herbie77: These countries have no idea what democracy really means because they have no experience of it, so getting used to political responsibility will take time.
Seadeva: There is not a country in the world….in the world….that really knows what Democracy really is because we've never had it! Not true democracy. The entire planet is government by degrees of dictatorships. Some countries may have 'better' dictatorships than others but we are still united in our common experience of ignorance, which is the basis for such systems. Political responsibility is totally arbitrary. Are the political responsibilities of the Indonesian Pygmies, Saudi Arabia, China and the US on the same page? If Japan and China dogmatically follow their 'political responsibilities' in the Senkaku Islands would we see a peaceful and mutually co-operative solution this year, next year or thereafter?
herbie77: Gadaffi was not just a simple dictator who used his secret service and military to remain in power, he was also a pedophile serial rapist who preyed on young girls between 12 and 18 years old.
It is estimated that he raped tens of thousands of young Libyan schoolgirls during his 40 year dictatorship.
Seadeva: Don't the west use their military and secret service to fulfill their own ends? Regarding the claims that he was a serial rapist etc. We simply do not know. But we d know that the story began with a famous French journalist Annick Cojean who is a a foreign correspondent for Le Monde. A paper which has a history of shady financial dealings and corruption that compromise any pretense of independence. Of course, the paper also has a strong geo-political stance on world events and is far from impartial. The paper is directed by a man who is deeply entrenched in the economic and financial sector which, of course, would be quite valuable as an asset, in the west's in
…. interests in the Middle East. So, i'm just saying take these into consideration. Do we have other independent source to verify this information from reputable sources? Not that I have seen.
Reply to Ashcan: Safe is relative concept. What I am saying is the west should refrain from using force to topple governments and countries for THEIR selfish purposes and seek to reconcile differences of opinions, politics, economics and ideologies by redirecting their resources towards their own countries FIRST to solve THEIR problems which are numerous. We need to make our countries worthy of respect. Worthy of inspiring other countries to follow or co-operate with us in our shared problems. But this co-operation cannot be achieved through threats or coercion. It must come through understanding and putting our priorities in their rightful place. All countries have the option to evolve or involve themselves. Even the most despotic governments couldn't rule without the sanction of people who compose that country. It's simply not possible. So, we need to educate ourselves in such a way that we realize that our very actions, or in-action, contributes towards either giving our gov
….. governments the sanction to rule us or to represent us. Of course, military force can and does change countries, and that's the main point. The military are not humanitarian forces, they are military ones! There is not a single country in history, at any time, that has ever or will ever achieve peace through military force, it simply cannot be done. To create peace the very forces behind such revolution, and it would be a revolution, would have to be peaceful. This is the only way to break the vicious circle.
http://news.digitalcrossroads.com/201211891/breaking-news-2/your-questions-about-gaddafi-and-libya-39/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=your-questions-about-gaddafi-and-libya-39
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